Celia Says; and Dream
Celia wrote me this note in response to my post Snap and gave me the OK to post it, because I thought she made a really good point:
I admire you for your ability to endure a relationship that many would have found impossible. While a relationship with Jefferson (and his many girlfriends) may be “right” for some… it may not be right for all. And when you think about it, successful poly relationships are essentially relationships with many people. Not with just your one guy, but you have to ultimately get along with all of them. And if you don’t, well as you’ve discovered, there’s trouble in paradise.
In my opinion (and remember i’m in a mono marriage) any other partners need to do their best to co-exist and be respectful of each other’s relationships with Jefferson as well as respectful of any of his other partner’s needs. From what you’ve relayed, that doesn’t seem to be happening which is a recipe for disaster.
Whatever you decide to do, whether it be to continue lighting a fire and burning your bridge or allowing J’s water to wash over you, I hope that you find the happiness you deserve. You are a special, wonderful girl that is an amazing catch for any guy (or girl).
I really agree with that.
Now, I know it’s not nice call someone Miss Priss or Ms. Stick-up-her-ass, but I’m really no longer obligated to be nice or even civil now that I’m done with Jefferson.
But when I first started seeing Jefferson, I wanted to be nice and buddy buddy with all the girls I’d read about. So I had my blog and then I created a MySpace and I went to add Jefferson and Meg and Viviane and Madeline and Mitzi (she had a profile for a hot second). Jefferson, Meg, and Mitzi all added me no problem but Viviane and Madeline never did, and naive, silly me thought it was some computer error and I resent requests a few times until it hit me they had no intention of being friends with me.
And as time went on and I learned better the dynamic of Jefferson’s group I realized, “Ohh, so I’m back in the 6th grade.” Great, I fucking hated the 6th grade! Cliques, cattiness, rivalry and jealousy (now mind you, it took me a while actually before I started getting jealous as well).
You know something, times that I was happiest with Jefferson was when I was getting along with everyone else. And some of my top memories are from when Jefferson, Mitzi, and I would share a bed at the end of the night. And then there were bad times where I felt ostracized by the other women. Those weren’t very happy times.
I had this dream this morning that was quite pleasant and gave me the warm fuzzies as I was having it (and then I woke up and realized what reality was). I dreamt I was in bed with Jefferson and Madeline at the end of a sex party. I was sleepily curled up next to Jefferson while Madeline was on the other side. And in the dream, not only did she put her arm around Jefferson, but me as well, which I remember surprising me a little (she also had super soft skin in my dream). And then she said something about cheesecake and I said “Mmm, I love cheesecake,” and they laughed because they thought I was asleep. And then she had to go and kissed Jefferson and like petted my hair. I was cuddled up with Jefferson but remembered that we were broken up, so I didn’t think it was right that we were being all cuddly.
Dreams are funny, huh?
Boy do I wish a blog like mine had been around when I first met Jefferson so I just could’ve known. I may have still decided to meet Jefferson, but at least I would’ve been better informed and not caught up and disillusioned by the fantasy and romanticism of (especially) his blog.
Dreams, Random musings | 
Avah | June 16, 2007
By Mitzi, June 16, 2007 @ 12:16 pm
I love what Celia has to say. Avah, I think you are doing some really great processing of the situation right now. I’ll keep saying it, I’m so proud of you.
For the record, I too loved when the three of us shared a bed. Regarding your dream, there was a time in real life, when you reached beyond the man in the middle to include me in your embrace as you fell asleep. That was one of the few moments in my relationship with him that I felt melted of all jealousies, and content to share someone that I cared for so much. It wasn’t girl v. girl for boy, it was everyone together.
By Celia, June 16, 2007 @ 1:23 pm
Hmmm… had another few thoughts to share.
Though I do feel the need for a great big disclaimer before I write these things out. LOL Something along the lines of “I only fuck one guy, so you can toss my opinion out with that used condom over there.”
Anyway.
IMO, fucking J and uttering the L word takes a heap of responsibility and settles it squarely on your shoulders. He is poly, it is no secret that he fucks a gaggle of women. If that’s the case, when someone enters into any type of relationship with him, they need to be prepared to coexist peacefully with his other partners.
Does that mean you have to drop to your knees and lick the new girls pussy in welcome? No. What it should mean to every partner involved is that J has decided to open his life to this woman and for that reason alone, she deserves and should be right in expecting, a certain level of civility and respect.
There are so many women (at least it appears that way) that they can’t ALL be expected to get along and be best buds. But come on! Not friending someone on myspace? What-ever. Grow up. You are a grown up, are you not? Obviously you’ve reached adulthood as determined by our government otherwise you wouldn’t be in J’s bed.
Poly relationships seem to be a lesson in juggling for all partners and while I agree that the female (and occasional) male participants in J’s relationships need to re-evaluate their behavior and status as one of his girl/boyfriends, I think J also needs to realize that just perhaps he is NOT the best juggler in town. Fucker and cock sucker… maybe. Juggler… not from what I’ve read.
PS. Disclaimer once again for those that skipped it: I don’t know you, you don’t know me. What I do know is what I read and these opinions have been formed from what is made available to the general public for consumption.
By Josh, June 16, 2007 @ 3:07 pm
You know, not *everyone* does poly the way Jefferson does. I certainly don’t. If a person I’m seeing doesn’t get along with someone who’s a primary partner, or oven someone I spend a significant amount of time with, it’s a problem, and I deal with it, because if I don’t it’s obvious drama is going to happen.
Honestly, I’m not sure that you (Avah) are cut out for being poly at this point in your life. I think you might want to consider someone who’ll take a good amount of their time and be able to focus it on you, because you’re a good person, and you deserve it.
In the meanwhile, (IMO, not like you have to listen, but it’s advice) de-stress and enjoy yourself. Focus on what makes you calm and happy. Work on your sense of self worth outside of a relationship with him.
By Just a thought..., June 16, 2007 @ 4:40 pm
I think Jefferson might clarify and say he prefers to call himself a Slut rather then Poly, specificly due to what Poly implies and brings with it.
By Viviane, June 16, 2007 @ 5:21 pm
Plese take me off your blogroll.
By Joy, June 16, 2007 @ 5:30 pm
Amen to Josh’s comment about different ways of “doing” poly. Admittedly, I’m *not* poly at this point in time, but it’s a hugely compelling arrangement to me…at least, the way I’d do it. Which is much more along Josh’s lines than along Jefferson’s (as much fun as it is to read about orgies and casual sex…I don’t think my psyche would put up with it). I have seen poly relationships work, and when they work it is because of the mutual respect and honesty and communication that exists between the partners. But it’s hard. It really is. As the others have said, do what’s right for you.
By Horatio, June 16, 2007 @ 5:58 pm
I have been reading quite a few of the participants blogs for a while.
Just a opinion or POV if you will.
I am in a relationship with two women currently. It evolved by me being involved with one woman first and we decided together to bring another woman into our bed.
Now since it was a mutual decision we all share in the joy of spending time together. Do I get together with one when the other is not available, sure. Do they get together when I am out of town on business? Sure.
Jealousy? Nope. Because the decision was made together and trust and most importantly consideration was established.
It seems like your feelings were not taken into consideration in this relationship. If your feelings are not being considered in my opinion you are not in a relationship. You are a receptacle.
You can dress it up in rope and twine and leather but you are still just a container and no person should be subject to that.
Take this as a learning event that will make you stronger, perhaps a little bit jaded for a short time and your next relationship will flourish.
Good Luck!
By Avah, June 16, 2007 @ 10:51 pm
My first instinct is to say no, Viviane, because you really have no control who links to you (and God that’s really so dumb to even care). My 2nd instinct is: well of course I don’t actually want you on my blog roll (I hate you that much), but people that I like and respect also contribute to the site.
Of course I should be the mature one (seeing that I’m like 30 years your junior) and not get into an online pissing match with someone who goes through life like they’re on a 6th grade play ground (but damn I love a good pissing match).
But ultimately, no, I’ll link to whomever I want to link to thank you very much.
By Celia, June 17, 2007 @ 5:38 am
Just a Thought-
Good point. If a person were a self-proclaimed slut, then all of these relationship/poly entaglements and headaches are avoided. Simply by preferring to use one word instead of another. In which case…bravo! He’s avoided the need to buy stock in Bayer.
But what if a Slut utters that one little four letter word? Now, IMO, that’s when the line between Slut and Poly disappears.
Am I totally off the mark? Possibly, hell, probably. But, it is something for the Slut’s of the world to consider before dropping that dirty little word in their partner’s laps.
By anon, June 17, 2007 @ 9:09 am
I have a lot of sympathy for you because I’ve been reading you for a while now although I haven’t commented. I admit I only know what you choose to show us. So please take this comment in the spirit it is meant. It’s meant to be helpful and not hurtful. I’m a woman and I was in a poly relationship and I feel like I really understand so much of what you are going through.
I don’t know what these women might have done to harm you. Maybe there’s stuff you haven’t posted. But don’t you think it’s wrong to blame the other women when the man we love lets us down? Even if we’re in a traditional relationship and he cheats we know that our anger at her is really anger at him. I respect your rage and your grief but I think maybe you’re putting it in the wrong direction. I am confused and I can’t understand how you could hate Madeline when you admit you had never even met her. I always assumed that you had met her from the way you wrote.
I hope you find someone wonderful who gives you everything you deserve and want. Keep writing!
By Wendy, June 17, 2007 @ 1:41 pm
Anon, Its very easy to hate someone you never even met. When Jordin cheated on me with that bitch Tiffany, I hated her was a passion bordering on insanity. I hated him too, but I felt like he was a weak, stupid man who fell off the long distance relationship wagon. I hated her coz she knew about me, knew we were dating, and went after him anyway. Also, she was younger, skinnier and closer to him than me.
When we did eventually meet, which he sprung on us out of the blue, we were hissing and spitting at each other, not him. Love makes you stupid sometimes.